cells-devel

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567 discussions

[Fwd: Re: [cells-devel] observer design question]
by Ken Tilton 28 Mar '08

28 Mar '08

[ooops--for the list] -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [cells-devel] observer design question Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 10:44:15 -0400 From: Ken Tilton <kennytilton(a)optonline.net> Organization: Theory Y Learning To: achambers.home(a)gmail.com References: <a70cc98c0803280617n161f774ek466efe371228d2bb(a)mail.gmail.com> <47ECF307.5000704(a)optonline.net> <a70cc98c0803280730t27003f4dgbf5bc8d2fc22dbf2(a)mail.gmail.com> Andy Chambers wrote: > On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 1:30 PM, Ken Tilton <kennytilton(a)optonline.net> wrote: > >>Andy Chambers wrote: >> > My model consists of a family tree of objects all of which have an >> > xhtml ruled cell. The client needs to >> > be updated if the value of this slot has changed. However, a change >> > in one would cascade up >> > the tree so if we were logging these changes, and sending them down to >> > the client, one of the >> > things we send would be the entire document which is not what we want. >> >> How did the entire document change (I mean in /precisely/ what way such >> that your app wanted to send the whole thing? > > > The xhtml rule (for an html div) looks almost like this (in the real > one there's a line to > put the attributes in too). > > (c? (with-output-to-string (s) > (with-html-output (s) > (:div > (str (apply #'concatenate 'string > (mapcar #'xhtml (^kids)))))))) > > So the value of it depends on its kids. If any of the kids change, > then the xhtml slot on the div object will also > change. If I was to put an observer on xhtml, it would fire all the > way up the tree from each leaf that changed > wouldn't it? Yes. This is cool, this is like OpenGL display lists which are like objects in that my parent does not need to be rebuilt on the OpenGL side just because I have changed, my parent display list just runs and when it calls me -- well, it is more like Lisp with changing a function defintition while the application is running, my new display instructions get executed. So what I am hearing between the lines is that the kid can change and push itself over to the DOM (if I have the jargon right) and the browser will Do the Right Thing in re getting everything rendered? Get back to me to confirm, meanwhile I will refresh on the sleight of hand I did to make display lists work. IIRC the trick will be to have each rule turn off dependency tracking, sample each kid to get them up to date, then turn dependency back on for the /assembly/ of the kids into the current xhtml result. kt

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[cells-devel] cell dependancies
by Andy Chambers 27 Mar '08

27 Mar '08

I'm not sure whether I would actually need this but was wondering if user code can get a cell's dependancies? Maybe we could pass this information along to the javascript. I've been thinking about the caching thing I mentioned on c.l.l Caching is certainly possible in javascript. Even the browser's own caching system could be used if we use a REST based system although since we're aggregating events, this might not be so useful (lots of unique requests so less chance of a cache hit). The solution would be to send a list of requests, and in the response, include each request with its resulting updates. Add these to the cache and we should get more hits. -- Andy

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Re: [cells-devel] family hierarchies
by Andy Chambers 27 Mar '08

27 Mar '08

On Wed, Mar 26, 2008 at 1:57 AM, Ken Tilton <kennytilton(a)optonline.net> wrote: > Andy, > > Food for thought: I just noticed a recent email from Peter Hildebrandt > who had likewise wished he had time to do what you are doing. Peter > struck me as very solid (as do you <g>). Sounds like things are going > well for you, so you might mention Hunchncells on cells-devel or even > c.l.lisp when you are ready for company, or we could just try Peter > and/or Edi Weitz directly. I thought I had but looking back, it does seem that some of these exchanges have been sent directly to you Kenny. Sorry about that, I didn't mean to exclude anyone. So for the list.... I've picked off some of the low-hanging fruit in an effort to make hunchentoot handlers cells-aware. Most of the code so far has just been doing the equivalent of deftk but creating "html" widgets instead of tk ones. http://gitorious.org/projects/hunchncells The way this will work I think is as follows:- (most of this is vaporware) 1) request comes in from hunchentoot 2) cells handler gets "root" family object from hunchentoot session (or creates a fresh one) 3) kick off the propagation by setf'ing the request slot on root 4) an initial response is created from the xhtml slot of the root ...user does something on the browser end... 5) make ajax call to updates service 6) the update handler feeds some new paramaters into the model 5) observers on .kids, and .value log changes into an updates slot on the root 6) the updates are sent back down to the client The updates would be a list of strings representing updates to the DOM. When it gets to the client, it is simply eval'd and hopefully, the page reflects the new state. Here's some other stuff I've been thinking about. 1) In celtk, it seems like pretty much all events are sent from tk to cells for handling by the widget-event-handle. I think that doing the same for javascript events would be too expensive. Perhaps we could classify events into those that need to be sent immediately, those that can be sent periodically (say every 5 seconds), and those that can be ignored. I think even this would be probably not be scalable but I don't work for google so I don't have to worry about that ;-). 2) How do we feed these javascript events into the model? This would probably be another handler on a different url that listens for events specified as ajax GETs like this... GET /events?event=change&id=I034&new=somevalue It feeds these onto an events slot on the model and returns the current value of the updates slot mentioned above to the client -- Andy

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[cells-devel] .kids/.kid-slots
by Andy Chambers 27 Mar '08

27 Mar '08

Just a quick one, What's the reasoning behind naming these slots this way (instead of kids/kid-slots)? -- Andy

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[cells-devel] eval-now (utils-kt)
by Andy Chambers 26 Mar '08

26 Mar '08

Is all that export! and eval-now! stuff a convenience for your ide or is it something you invented to make sure your code gets loaded/compiled in the right order? I ask because I'm trying to make what I've done so far at least asdf-loadable. There's some code up at gitorious (http://gitorious.org/projects/hunchncells) if you have a git available. If not, and you'd like a copy, I can zip it across off-list. -- Andy

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[cells-devel] family hierarchies
by Andy Chambers 25 Mar '08

25 Mar '08

Does it cause problems if a family is defined on a slot different from kids? I ask because in a webified cells, you'd probably want to define the model on a :page slot or something. (defmodel web-app (family) ((page ...) (request ...) (:default-initargs :page (c? (the-kids ....))) I've made a few macros based on those in celtk that use cl-who to populate an xhtml slot. The families are building up quite nicely now. I am having one problem though. The web pages are constructed using macros like this... (mk-page (:titile "some page") (mk-div () (mk-text "hello world"))) I created a definehtml macro to make a defmodel and a corresponding mk- macro for a few of the commonly used html elements (I'll do the others as and when required). What I'm not sure about is the mk-text for simple strings. On the plus side, I can use a rule to escape special characters like & et el. Another plus is that we can put all text inside addressable span elements so if only that bit of text updates, we can send the appropriate bit of javascript down to the client that pin-points the change we want. Here's roughly how one of the mk- macros look at the moment. (defmacro mk-div ((&rest inits) &body body) `(make-instance 'div ,@inits :fm-parent *parent* :kids (c? (the-kids ,@(loop for kid in body when (stringp kid) collect (mk-text kid) else collect kid)))))) ;; not sure about the parens here, I edited a bit in email What I'd really like is to examine the type of each form in body to see if its a string. If so, use the mk-text macro to make that string into a family object. What you see above does do that but it doesn't pick up the *parent*, presumably because the macroexpansion of the mk-text bit happens before *parent* has been evaluated. Maybe the easiest thing would just be to use a really short name for the mk-text macro and be done with it. Cheers, Andy

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[cells-devel] tile slot
by Andy Chambers 23 Mar '08

23 Mar '08

Hi, Are you supposed to be able to use the tile? slot to determine whether a tile widget is used? I've been trying to convert some of the demos distributed with tk itself to celtk but because the tile widgets are used by default, you can't set any style properties. I tried the code below but cells thinks the relief slot needs a parent. I get the error.... "New as of Cells3: parent must be supplied to make-instance of KEYWORD kid RELIEF" (defmodel tk-labels (window) () (:default-initargs :title$ "Label Demonstration" :kids (c? (the-kids (mk-stack (:packing (c?pack-self "-side top")) (mk-label :wraplength "4i" :tk-justify 'left :text (concatenate 'string "Five labels are displayed below: three textual ones on the left and a bitmap" "label and a text label on the right. Labels are pretty boring " "because you can't do anything with them.")) (mk-row () (mk-stack (:pady 2 :layout-anchor 'w) (mk-label :text "First Label") (mk-label :tile? nil) :relief (c? 'raised) :text "Second Label, raised" (mk-label :tile? nil :text "Third Label, sunken" :relief (c? 'sunken))))))))) Am I going about this the wrong way? Another problem I'm having is to do with packing. Are you really supposed to be able to express the layout of a whole app with just one pack statement? I'd like to have a panel of expander widgets each of which is packed so that it fills on the x-axis. I expect that other panels would probably have different packing requirements but if you put more than one (c?pack-self ...) in an app, you get an error saying "don't specify packing here. Cheers, Andy

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by Lloyd 20 Mar '08

20 Mar '08

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[cells-devel] expander copyright stuff
by Andy Chambers 20 Mar '08

20 Mar '08

Hey Kenny, At the moment, each file in celtk has a license header as printed below. I'd like to put my name somewhere on the file for expander.lisp but am not sure if it is correct to simply replace your name with mine since then if someone only looked at that file, it looks like I did the whole thing. May I suggest that I just put an additional line under the existing copyright one that says something like Copyright (C) 2008 by Andy Chambers Cheers, Andy #| Celtk -- Cells, Tcl, and Tk Copyright (C) 2006 by Kenny Tilton This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it under the terms of the Lisp Lesser GNU Public License (http://opensource.franz.com/preamble.html), known as the LLGPL. This library is distributed WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. See the Lisp Lesser GNU Public License for more details. |#

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[cells-devel] observers
by Andy Chambers 18 Mar '08

18 Mar '08

Two questions... 1) What's the best way to remove an observer that's been set on some slot? 2) If there's an observer like (defobserver image-files ((self widget)) (loop for (name file-pathname) in (set-difference new-value old-value :key 'car) do (tk-format `(:pre-make-tk ,self) "image create photo ~(~a.~a~) -file {~a} -height ~a -width ~a" (^path) name (namestring file-pathname) (^height)(^width)))) ....can I make one that specializes on a subclass of widget that overrides the first? How does one do this? -- Andy

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