[LispSea] starting point
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This is for those interested in Lisp programming in Seattle: As a group, we need to start somewhere, and I'm putting a stake in the sand. My approach is to keep things simple but not simplistic. For the time being, the home page is: http://wiki.alu.org/lispsea The purpose of this group is to "promote, nurture & expand Lisp in Seattle". But what does that mean? By promote, I mean selling Lisp to businesses-- not a specific tool chain but the idea that Lisp is perhaps more appropriate than other mainstream options available. In order to promote Lisp, this involves contacting various employers in the area to see if they're currently using Lisp and if not, find out why and address those issues. Think of it as illustrating the need so those of you who wish to do consulting have an easier path. To nurture: semi-formal sessions will be offered to present and discuss different aspects of Lisp. This includes specific tools. I'll be the focal point for the time being and will lead the early sessions. While I'll be the default presenter initially, my personal tools are common lisp. Where other Lisps are concerned, either someone else can present to the group, or if too shy, show me, and I'll present the topic. I'm always open to learning... For expanding Lisp, this applies to more than just the Seattle metro area. LispNYC recently announced that they're providing mentors for a few projects within Google's Summer of Code. While it's too early to really worry about the next one, let's entertain the possibility. Additionally, we expand Lisp by talking about it to others and having facts readily available. This means as a community, doing our part such as contributing to the new FAQ effort-- which needs help! Finally, we can expand use of Lisp by contributing to ancillary efforts like the "Lisp movies" that demonstrate some unique quality of a particular library or updating documentation where it might be lacking. So this element is about more than just Seattle. Obvious questions begin with how, when, who and so on. First: how. I'm looking into reserving a classroom at Seattle Central Community College, even though this group has no direct affiliation with any school. Regarding the classroom-- think of it as complimentary to SeaFunc (functional programming; see the above URL), which meets in a tavern. Rather than make you choose one format over the other, you have the option of either or preferably both. I've toyed with the idea of formally creating a free course through the UW Experimental College or something similar, but let's try a looser model first. The objective for the classroom type of venue is to convey information so we all can expand our knowledge. (clean sound, video projector, etc) I've found taverns to be difficult when the group grows beyond single digit counts. ...and yes, I'm planning that by autumn, we'll have those numbers. As with other group meetings, the format would probably begin with social time then move into a specific topic for 20-60 minutes and ending with more conversation time. (We'll look into sponsorship for the obligatory stack of pizzas to precede presentation.) When: Once a location is arranged, we'll set a date. There is a possibility that the first meeting could be the last week of June but probably July. Summer always introduces conflicts on people's time, but this is an opportunity to get the bugs out. (As with the Vancouver meetings, I'll record my sessions, so people won't miss anything.) Who: I plan to present at the first few sessions. This isn't so much to set the pace or tone but to ensure that there is content and to build momentum. Topics: While there is LispBox, which does a good job of getting you started, my first presentation will be to move beyond the learning mode. Likewise, since installing a free common lisp system involves more than extracting a tar file or even knowing tweaky 'configure' options, the first session will probably be this: MacOSX + sbcl + Emacs + Slime with VirtualPC running FreeBSD (aka, fixing the reddit.com model). A subsequent session might be Apache with mod_lisp (specifically different than the web project in Peter Seibel's book, just to give you options). By the way, I'm a Unix systems programmer by trade, and by that, I tend to do software systems integration involving a multi-server architecture. For more on my Lisp background, follow the links at the above URL. This gives you somewhat of an idea of where my presentations will originate, but of course we're never just the sum of our jobs... Thank you for participating! -Daniel
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Daniel Pezely wrote:
I'm looking into reserving a classroom at Seattle Central Community College, even though this group has no direct affiliation with any school.
If the goal is to get business people interested in Lisp, wouldn't an Eastside venue such as Bellevue Community College or Digipen be more appropriate? Or a business; it's actually best to avoid schools with students if you want business people. Anyways, on the Seattle side, between SCCC and U. Washington, mightn't the latter have more CS clout? I'm just having a very hard time seeing business people showing up at SCCC. Who does the WSA usually hit on for meeting space?
Topics: While there is LispBox, which does a good job of getting you started, my first presentation will be to move beyond the learning mode. Likewise, since installing a free common lisp system involves more than extracting a tar file or even knowing tweaky 'configure' options, the first session will probably be this: MacOSX + sbcl + Emacs + Slime with VirtualPC running FreeBSD (aka, fixing the reddit.com model).
Fine to see. One of the problems of Common Lisp is "gee how do you try this out for cheap on Windows?" Relevant in this town. I dumped the Bigloo Scheme-to-C compiler and started looking at Common Lisp to get into a bigger developer community, with more standards and possibly jobs. But on Windows, for games, dealing with C FFIs, and on a limited budget, there was no "common" in Common Lisp at all. Each implementation was a right unto its own. That's no better than the Scheme universe, so I moved on to the Chicken Scheme-to-C compiler. Somewhat less performance than Bigloo, somewhat larger community, better source license (BSD rather than GPL), has some C++ support, has SWIG support. I've made the right decision for the game industry, which is what I'm stalking, but I have no idea in any other development space. I'm clueless. I've been trying to get the Chicken MinGW build up to snuff for 9 months now. I'm almost done. Some brave souls have been trying to port SBCL to Win32. Judging from archives such as http://sbcl-internals.cliki.net/Win32 there's been real progress, but it's not ready for prime time. There is of course CLISP on the cheap and well supported side, but it's only an interpreter and that's not very exciting. Maybe there are some market segments where interpreter-only is fine, but I have a performance prejudice and tend to regard such things as toys. If anyone can demonstrate anything "significant" in CLISP I'd change my tune, particularly if there's money in it. Cheers, Brandon Van Every
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Brandon J. Van Every wrote:
Daniel Pezely wrote:
Topics: While there is LispBox, which does a good job of getting you started, my first presentation will be to move beyond the learning mode. Likewise, since installing a free common lisp system involves more than extracting a tar file or even knowing tweaky 'configure' options, the first session will probably be this: MacOSX + sbcl + Emacs + Slime with VirtualPC running FreeBSD (aka, fixing the reddit.com model).
Fine to see.
One of the problems of Common Lisp is "gee how do you try this out for cheap on Windows?"
I'm realizing that packaging and setup issues are even more problematic on Windows. Cygwin aside, there isn't just some package repository to pull from. Cheers, Brandon Van Every
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Daniel, thanks for kicking this off ! Probably won't be at the first couple meetings but will make it up at some point. There are a few things that I have to share regarding a recent project and lots to hear from everyone else too.
participants (3)
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Brandon J. Van Every
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Daniel Pezely
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Justin Grant