Hi Cyrus,

On Thu, 18 Jan 2007 00:14:34 -0800, Cyrus Harmon ch-tbnl@bobobeach.com wrote:

Thanks for the new releases. I hate to be a pest about this, and I think this was covered before, but I can't remember the answer. Is there any way we could convince you to host hunchentoot's source in a publicly accessible source code control system? I'd love to be able to just do a diff against the repository to see what has changed.

Don't remember if this has been covered before, but I'll try to give an elaborate answer this time so I can refer to it later... :)

1. I use CVS mostly as a convenient backup mechanism for myself, so I can revert to previous versions if I broke something or restore code that I accidentally dismissed. I don't write clever change comments (in fact, I usually don't write any except something like "..." to appease Emacs), so the CVS history looks pretty boring. I do tag releases, but that's about it.

2. I have everything on my laptop which I regularly also use to work in coffee bars or trains where I don't have Internet access. Every source control system that will be publicly accessible won't be accessible to /me/ in these situations.

3. I wouldn't want to set up /any/ source control system on one of my own servers, because I wouldn't want to cope with more potential security risks. Yes, I could use common-lisp.net, but although they're doing a great job their uptime in the last year hasn't been outstanding.

4. I believe in the "release often" mantra, i.e. as soon as there's a new feature or a bugfix it is given a release number and pushed out of the door - you're not missing out on stuff that's lying around in my local repository just because I'm too lazy or too busy to release it. You'll also get a (short, yes) comment in the change log, and as I tend to document everything I think that most users won't have to do more than to look at the updated documentation for the functions mentioned there.

5. Not having a public source code control system also effectively means that there'll be no real collaboration on these projects. This is fine for me as I don't believe in equal-right group development anyway. I tried it a couple of times and I was never happy with the outcome, probably because I'm too anal with how I think code and documentation should look like.

Of course, I happily accept patches and I do that a lot - look at the change logs of my projects.

6. At this point someone will inevitably come up with this shiny new source code control system foo-42 that solves all of the problems mentioned above. I tend to think that technology doesn't solve social problems, but apart from that: Can I easily use foo-42 with NT Emacs from Windows like I can use CVS now?

The short version of this is: Right now, I actively maintain more than 20 open source Lisp projects all of which I use for my commercial stuff. This is fun, but it's also a lot of work. I don't have enough energy and spare time for anything that would increase this amount of work even if it would make half a dozen fellow hackers happy.

Sorry if this sounds snide, it wasn't meant to... :)

Cheers, Edi.

Scribit Edi Weitz dies 18/01/2007 hora 10:01:

2. I have everything on my laptop which I regularly also use to work

in coffee bars or trains where I don't have Internet access. Every source control system that will be publicly accessible won't be accessible to /me/ in these situations.

The same requirement led me to take a look at the various decentralized version control systems. If you ever work on two machines or more, it's definitely worth the try (but it's not a trivial effort, because you have to choose among many competing systems).

6. [...] apart from that: Can I easily use foo-42 with NT Emacs from

Windows like I can use CVS now?

As far as the jungle of decentralized SCM is concerned, that requirement helps: it rules out most of them... For half a matter of technical merits and half a matter of taste, I finally settled on Mercurial. It has an Emacs extension (minor mode? I use Emacs for Lisp but I'm not that familiar with it) and I think it runs under NT.

By the way, I'll try to track the versions of some of Edi's packages, and if someone is interested, I could make a Mercurial repository publicly available. If Mercurial is not your favourite VCS, I suppose you could then use something like tailor to have your VCS populated from the Mercurial repo...

Distributedly, Pierre

On Thu, 15 Feb 2007 03:41:00 +0100, Pierre THIERRY nowhere.man@levallois.eu.org wrote:

After fighting CVS and Apache proxying, I'm now at last setting up some public repositories of selected packages. Currently only chunga is available, but others will follow soon, all referenced at this URI:

http://arcanes.fr.eu.org/~pierre/2007/02/weitz/

I will add flexi-streams, hunchentoot and tbnl at least. If some of you are interested in other packages, please tell me.

Thanks. I've added a link from the Chunga homepage. Let me know once you're done with the other libs, and I'll add links there as well.

On Fri, 23 Feb 2007 02:11:25 +0100, Pierre THIERRY nowhere.man@levallois.eu.org wrote:

I'm about to convert hunchentoot's history to Mercurial. Did I miss any released version, I have:

• 0.4.[0-12]
• 0.5.[0-1]
• 0.6.[0-2]

There should be some more (0.4.[13-14] and 0.1.0 to 0.3.2):

http://weitz.de/hunchentoot/CHANGELOG

Cheers, Edi.

On Sat, 24 Feb 2007 23:34:07 +0100, Pierre THIERRY nowhere.man@levallois.eu.org wrote:

I tailored the CVS that you sent me to Mercurial. Tailor made 95 revisions from the CVS history, with the following tags (tip is CVS's HEAD):

tip 94:78a1ee48145a v0_4_12a 91:9924c504f990 v0_4_12 89:0eb6be2ef96c v0_4_11 87:7b75c61273fc v0_4_10 85:0c7490a6f44f v0_4_10a 84:83c6708799c8 v0_4_9 82:655bf0497aba v0_4_8 80:783b4329beed v0_4_7 77:5db448c76456 v0_4_6 75:ed5bd153eb0f v0_4_5 70:f00b9f695a1f v0_4_4 64:61f994bc1601 v0_4_3 60:c83530b7585a v0_4_2 56:9b22345c9dbb v0_4_1 54:a3947418430a v0_4_0 51:cbdd37106c9c test2 49:86c23e4f46d5 beta4 34:7081f12b95bf beta3 22:c2289f6442f7 beta2 13:3851ecf907cf cl 11:f603e2691360 Edi 0:da8577174ba5

Did my conversion tool missed something? (if yes, maybe it would help me debug the problem if you could tell me where the missing versions should appear)

Hmm, it seems the versions before 0.4.0 were in a different CVS repository that I've thrown away since - sorry for that. Of course, what comes after 0.4.12 isn't in there as I sent it some time ago already.

Scribit Edi Weitz dies 15/02/2007 hora 08:27:

Let me know once you're done with the other libs, and I'll add links there as well.

Now hunchentoot is available too, with versions from 0.4.0 to 0.6.2.

http://arcanes.fr.eu.org/~pierre/2007/02/weitz/

As I have in the chunga and hunchentoot repositories all released versions that could be mirrored, those two repositories should remain stable, that is changesets identities will be preserved.

Distributively, Pierre

Scribit Pierre THIERRY dies 06/04/2007 hora 04:07:

The last project I have the history of is TBNL. If someone wants to see it mirrored also, I'll do it.

In fact, now that I have automated pretty much anything in the process, it's too easy to have an excuse not to do it. So I added TBNL also. Goes from 0.1.0 to 0.11.4...

Quickly, Pierre