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[CfP] ELS 2023, 16th European Lisp Symposium, April 24-25, Amsterdam
by Didier Verna 06 Dec '22

06 Dec '22

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 16th European Lisp Symposium Call for Papers April 24-25, 2023 Startup Village, Amsterdam, Nederlands https://www.european-lisp-symposium.org/2023 Sponsored by EPITA and DIRO ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Important Dates ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ - Submission deadline: February 26, 2023 - Author notification: March 26, 2023 - Final papers due: April 9, 2023 - Symposium: April 24-25, 2023 Scope ~~~~~ The European Lisp Symposium is a premier forum for the discussion and dissemination of all aspects of design, implementation and application of any of the Lisp dialects, including Common Lisp, Scheme, Emacs Lisp, Clojure, Racket, ACL2, AutoLisp, ISLISP, Dylan, SKILL, Hy, Shen, Carp, Janet, uLisp, Picolisp, Gamelisp, TXR, and so on. We encourage everyone interested in Lisp to participate. The European Lisp Symposium invites high quality papers about novel research results, insights and lessons learned from practical applications, and educational perspectives. We also encourage submissions about known ideas as long as they are presented in a new setting and/or in a highly elegant way. Topics include but are not limited to: - context-, aspect-, domain-oriented and generative programming - macro-, reflective-, meta- and/or rule-based development approaches - language design and implementation - language integration, inter-operation and deployment - development methodologies, support and environments - educational approaches and perspectives - experience reports and case studies Technical Program ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ We invite submissions in the following forms. * Papers: technical papers of up to 8 pages that describe original results or explain known ideas in new and elegant ways. * Demonstrations: abstracts of up to 4 pages for demonstrations of tools, libraries, and applications. * Tutorials: abstracts of up to 4 pages for in-depth presentations about topics of special interest. All submissions should be formatted following the ACM SIGS guidelines and include ACM Computing Classification System 2012 concepts and terms. Submissions should be uploaded to Easy Chair, at the following link http://www.easychair.org/conferences/?conf=els2023. Note: to help us with the review process please indicate the type of submission by entering either "paper", "demo", or "tutorial" in the Keywords field. Programme Chair ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Stefan Monnier, DIRO, Université de Montréal Canada Programme Committee ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ TBA Local Chair ~~~~~~~~~~~ Breanndán Ó Nualláin, Machine Learning Programs, Nederlands -- Resistance is futile. You will be jazzimilated. Lisp, Jazz, Aïkido: http://www.didierverna.info

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[CfPart] ELS 2022, 15th European Lisp Symposium, March 21-22, Porto.
by Didier Verna 10 Mar '22

10 Mar '22

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 15th European Lisp Symposium Call for Participation March 21-22, 2022 FEUP, Porto, Portugal & Online In cooperation with ACM SIGPLAN https://www.european-lisp-symposium.org/2022 Sponsored by EPITA, Franz Inc., and SISCOG ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Important News ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ - Full programme now online - Invited speakers below - Registrations are open Scope ~~~~~ The European Lisp Symposium is a premier forum for the discussion and dissemination of all aspects of design, implementation and application of any of the Lisp dialects, including Common Lisp, Scheme, Emacs Lisp, Clojure, Racket, ACL2, AutoLisp, ISLISP, Dylan, SKILL, Hy, Shen, Carp, Janet, uLisp, Picolisp, Gamelisp, TXR, and so on. We encourage everyone interested in Lisp to participate. The European Lisp Symposium invites high quality papers about novel research results, insights and lessons learned from practical applications, and educational perspectives. We also encourage submissions about known ideas as long as they are presented in a new setting and/or in a highly elegant way. Topics include but are not limited to: - context-, aspect-, domain-oriented and generative programming - macro-, reflective-, meta- and/or rule-based development approaches - language design and implementation - language integration, inter-operation and deployment - development methodologies, support and environments - educational approaches and perspectives - experience reports and case studies Invited talks ~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Building SICMUtils, the Atelier of Abstractions -- Sam Ritchie SICMUtils is a Clojure library designed for interactive exploration of mathematical physics. It is simultaneously a work of persuasive writing, a collection of essays on functional pearls and computational ideas, a stable of workhorse functional abstractions, and a practical place to work and visualize algorithms and physical systems, on a server or in the browser. How do you build a library like this? This talk will go through the architecture of SICMUtils, based on many of the ideas of "additive programming" from Gerald Sussman and Chris Hanson's latest book, Software Design for Flexibility. We'll look at surprising examples of the system becoming easier to extend over time. Clojure's embrace of its host platform lets us use the best modern work in Javascript for visualization, while keeping the horsepower of our servers for real work. Lisp's particular elegance will shine throughout. Creating a Common Lisp Implementation -- Robert Strandh Being dissatisfied with the way current Common Lisp implementations are written, and with the duplication of system code between different implementations, we started the SICL project in 2008. The initial idea was to create modules that the creators of Common Lisp implementations could use to create a complete system from an initial minimal core. But this idea was unsatisfactory because it required each module to be written in a subset of Common Lisp. So instead, we decided to use the full language to implement these modules, effectively making them useless to an implementation using traditional bootstrapping techniques. We therefore decided to also create a new Common Lisp implementation (also named SICL), that could use those modules. A crucial element is a bootstrapping technique that can handle these modules. In this spirit, we have developed several modules, including an implementation of CLOS which is also an important element of bootstrapping. Lately, we have increased our level of ambition in that we want to extract those modules as separate (and separately maintained) repositories, which requires us to deal with code during bootstrapping that was not specifically written for SICL. In our talk, we describe this evolution of ambition, and its consequences to bootstrapping, in more detail. We also give an overview of several new techniques we created, some of which have been published (at ICL and ELS) and some of which have not. Finally, we discuss the future of the project, and other projects for which we imagine SICL to be a base. Lisp as Renaissance Workshop: A Lispy Tour through Mathematical Physics -- Sam Ritchie Lisp is an exquisite medium for the communication of computational ideas. From our most accurate observations of physical reality up through chemistry, biology, and cognition, the universe seems to be computing itself; modeling and simulating these systems in machines has led to incredible technological wealth. Deep principles and beautiful abstractions seem to drive these systems, but they have always been hard to discover; and we are floundering at the computational frontiers of intelligence, synthetic biology and control systems for our climate. The only way to push forward is to build powerful tools that can communicate and teach. This talk will take a tour through SICMUtils, a Lisp system designed as a workshop for conducting serious work in mathematical physics and sharing those explorations in a deeply interactive, multiplayer way. The library’s growth parallels our human scientific history; hopefully tools like this will help us write the next chapter. Programme Chair ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Jim Newton - EPITA Research Lab (LRDE), France Programme Committee ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Philipp Meier, Nubank Ioanna M. Dimitriou H., Igalia Mikhail Raskin, Technical University of Munich Nick Levine, RavenPack Adrien Pommellet, LRDE, EPITA Marco Heisig, Friedrich-Alexander-Universität Erlangen Alberto Riva, Bioinformatics Core, ICBR, University of Florida Marco Antoniotti, DISCo, Università degli Studi di Milano-Bicocca Nicolas Neuss, Friedrich-Alexander-Universität Erlangen Christophe Rhodes, Google UK Irène Anne Durand, LaBRI, University of Bordeaux Ralf Moeller Breanndán Ó Nualláino, University of Amsterdam Marc Battyani, Fractal Concept Pascal Costanza, Intel Sky Hester, Private Consultant -- Resistance is futile. You will be jazzimilated. Lisp, Jazz, Aïkido: http://www.didierverna.info

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[Extended Deadline] 15th European Lisp Symposium
by Didier Verna 24 Jan '22

24 Jan '22

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 15th European Lisp Symposium Call for Papers March 21-22, 2022 FEUP, Porto, Portugal & Online In co-location with <Programming> https://www.european-lisp-symposium.org/2022 Sponsored by EPITA and Franz Inc. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Important Dates ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ - Submission deadline ***EXTENDED***: January 30, 2022 - Author notification: February 21, 2022 - Final papers due: March 7, 2022 - Symposium: March 21-22, 2022 Scope ~~~~~ The European Lisp Symposium is a premier forum for the discussion and dissemination of all aspects of design, implementation and application of any of the Lisp dialects, including Common Lisp, Scheme, Emacs Lisp, Clojure, Racket, ACL2, AutoLisp, ISLISP, Dylan, SKILL, Hy, Shen, Carp, Janet, uLisp, Picolisp, Gamelisp, TXR, and so on. We encourage everyone interested in Lisp to participate. The European Lisp Symposium invites high quality papers about novel research results, insights and lessons learned from practical applications, and educational perspectives. We also encourage submissions about known ideas as long as they are presented in a new setting and/or in a highly elegant way. Topics include but are not limited to: - context-, aspect-, domain-oriented and generative programming - macro-, reflective-, meta- and/or rule-based development approaches - language design and implementation - language integration, inter-operation and deployment - development methodologies, support and environments - educational approaches and perspectives - experience reports and case studies Technical Program ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ We invite submissions in the following forms. * Papers: technical papers of up to 8 pages that describe original results or explain known ideas in new and elegant ways. * Demonstrations: abstracts of up to 4 pages for demonstrations of tools, libraries, and applications. * Tutorials: abstracts of up to 4 pages for in-depth presentations about topics of special interest for at least 90 minutes and up to 180 minutes. All submissions should be formatted following the ACM SIGS guidelines and include ACM Computing Classification System 2012 concepts and terms. Submissions should be uploaded to Easy Chair, at the following link http://www.easychair.org/conferences/?conf=els2022. Note: to help us with the review process please indicate the type of submission by entering either "paper", "demo", or "tutorial" in the Keywords field. Programme Chair ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Jim Newton - EPITA Research Lab (LRDE), France Programme Committee ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Philipp Meier, Nubank Ioanna M. Dimitriou H., Igalia Mikhail Raskin, Technical University of Munich Nick Levine, RavenPack Adrien Pommellet, LRDE, EPITA Marco Heisig, FAU Erlangen-Nürnberg Alberto Riva, Bioinformatics Core, ICBR, University of Florida Marco Antoniotti, DISCo, Università degli Studi di Milano-Bicocca Nicolas Neuss, Friedrich-Alexander-Universität Erlangen Christophe Rhodes, Google Irène Anne Durand, LaBRI, University of Bordeaux Ralf Moeller Breanndán Ó Nualláino, University of Amsterdam Marc Battyani, Fractal Concept Pascal Costanza, Intel -- Didier Verna <didier(a)elsaa.org> ELS Steering Committee

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[Last CfP] 15th European Lisp Symposium, March 21-22 2022, Porto
by Didier Verna 11 Jan '22

11 Jan '22

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 15th European Lisp Symposium Call for Papers March 21-22, 2022 FEUP, Porto, Portugal & Online In co-location with <Programming> https://www.european-lisp-symposium.org/2022 Sponsored by EPITA and Franz Inc. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Important Dates ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ - Submission deadline: January 23, 2022 - Author notification: February 21, 2022 - Final papers due: March 7, 2022 - Symposium: March 21-22, 2022 Scope ~~~~~ The European Lisp Symposium is a premier forum for the discussion and dissemination of all aspects of design, implementation and application of any of the Lisp dialects, including Common Lisp, Scheme, Emacs Lisp, Clojure, Racket, ACL2, AutoLisp, ISLISP, Dylan, SKILL, Hy, Shen, Carp, Janet, uLisp, Picolisp, Gamelisp, TXR, and so on. We encourage everyone interested in Lisp to participate. The European Lisp Symposium invites high quality papers about novel research results, insights and lessons learned from practical applications, and educational perspectives. We also encourage submissions about known ideas as long as they are presented in a new setting and/or in a highly elegant way. Topics include but are not limited to: - context-, aspect-, domain-oriented and generative programming - macro-, reflective-, meta- and/or rule-based development approaches - language design and implementation - language integration, inter-operation and deployment - development methodologies, support and environments - educational approaches and perspectives - experience reports and case studies Technical Program ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ We invite submissions in the following forms. * Papers: technical papers of up to 8 pages that describe original results or explain known ideas in new and elegant ways. * Demonstrations: abstracts of up to 4 pages for demonstrations of tools, libraries, and applications. * Tutorials: abstracts of up to 4 pages for in-depth presentations about topics of special interest for at least 90 minutes and up to 180 minutes. All submissions should be formatted following the ACM SIGS guidelines and include ACM Computing Classification System 2012 concepts and terms. Submissions should be uploaded to Easy Chair, at the following link http://www.easychair.org/conferences/?conf=els2021. Note: to help us with the review process please indicate the type of submission by entering either "paper", "demo", or "tutorial" in the Keywords field. Programme Chair ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Jim Newton - EPITA Research Lab, France Programme Committee ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Philipp Meier, Nubank Ioanna M. Dimitriou H., Igalia Mikhail Raskin, Technical University of Munich Nick Levine, RavenPack Adrien Pommellet, EPITA Research Lab Marco Heisig, FAU Erlangen-Nürnberg Alberto Riva, Bioinformatics Core, ICBR, University of Florida Marco Antoniotti, DISCo, Università degli Studi di Milano-Bicocca Nicolas Neuss, Friedrich-Alexander-Universität Erlangen Christophe Rhodes, Google Irène Anne Durand, LaBRI University of Bordeaux Ralf Moeller Breanndán Ó Nualláin Marc Battyani, Fractal Concept Pascal Costanza, Intel, Belgium -- Didier Verna

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macOS Monterey and Control-Space (set-mark)
by Martin Cracauer 29 Dec '21

29 Dec '21

Just want to send out a warning and a request for your experience: For me, macOS 12 "Monterey" breaks Control-Shift. While the control key is held down no space is delivered to applications like emacs, terminal or x11. Does anybody else see this? If you didn't update yet I recommend you don't. If you did update already you can use control-shift-space, which by default is also bound to set the mark. BTW, any Lisp jobs out there? I'm available. Martin -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Martin Cracauer <cracauer(a)cons.org> http://www.cons.org/cracauer/

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IRC lisp channels?
by Marco Antoniotti 18 Dec '21

18 Dec '21

Hi I guess this is mostly for phoe... What is the status of the IRC channels? I think I lost some bits during the year. Also, anybody interested in a Discord channel or a groups.io group? Happy holidays (especially Festivus) -- Marco Antoniotti, Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01 DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://dcb.disco.unimib.it Viale Sarca 336 I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY

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Scheme like question
by Marco Antoniotti 14 Dec '21

14 Dec '21

Hi apologies for the stupid question. I was reviewing some teaching material and looked at the following Scheme (form SICP) code about "streams". (define (integral integrand initial-value dt) (define int (cons-stream initial-value (add-streams (scale-stream integrand dt) int))) int) The question is how you'd rendered it in Common Lisp or how you would provide some macrology to mimic the inner define. I know this has been asked before... I am sure somebody knows the answer. All the best -- Marco Antoniotti, Professor tel. +39 - 02 64 48 79 01 DISCo, Università Milano Bicocca U14 2043 http://dcb.disco.unimib.it Viale Sarca 336 I-20126 Milan (MI) ITALY

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[CfP] 15th European Lisp Symposium, March 21-22 2022, Porto, Portugal
by Didier Verna 20 Oct '21

20 Oct '21

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 15th European Lisp Symposium Call for Papers March 21-22, 2022 FEUP, Porto, Portugal & Online In co-location with <Programming> http://www.european-lisp-symposium.org/2022 Sponsored by EPITA ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Important Dates ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ - Submission deadline: January 23, 2022 - Author notification: February 21, 2022 - Final papers due: March 7, 2022 - Symposium: March 21-22, 2022 Scope ~~~~~ The European Lisp Symposium is a premier forum for the discussion and dissemination of all aspects of design, implementation and application of any of the Lisp dialects, including Common Lisp, Scheme, Emacs Lisp, Clojure, Racket, ACL2, AutoLisp, ISLISP, Dylan, SKILL, Hy, Shen, Carp, Janet, uLisp, Picolisp, Gamelisp, TXR, and so on. We encourage everyone interested in Lisp to participate. The European Lisp Symposium invites high quality papers about novel research results, insights and lessons learned from practical applications, and educational perspectives. We also encourage submissions about known ideas as long as they are presented in a new setting and/or in a highly elegant way. Topics include but are not limited to: - Context-, aspect-, domain-oriented and generative programming - Macro-, reflective-, meta- and/or rule-based development approaches - Language design and implementation - Language integration, inter-operation and deployment - Development methodologies, support and environments - Educational approaches and perspectives - Experience reports and case studies Technical Program ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ We invite submissions in the following forms: * Papers: Technical papers of up to 8 pages that describe original results or explain known ideas in new and elegant ways. * Demonstrations: Abstracts of up to 4 pages for demonstrations of tools, libraries, and applications. * Tutorials: Abstracts of up to 4 pages for in-depth presentations about topics of special interest for at least 90 minutes and up to 180 minutes. All submissions should be formatted following the ACM SIGS guidelines and include ACM Computing Classification System 2012 concepts and terms. Submissions should be uploaded to Easy Chair, at the following http://www.easychair.org/conferences/?conf=els2021 Note: to help us with the review process please indicate the type of submission by entering either "paper", "demo", or "tutorial" in the Keywords field. Programme Chair ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Jim Newton - EPITA Research Lab (LRDE), France Programme Committee ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ tba -- Resistance is futile. You will be jazzimilated. Lisp, Jazz, Aïkido: http://www.didierverna.info

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[Reminder CfP] ELS 2021, 14th European Lisp Symposium, May 3-4
by Didier Verna 25 Feb '21

25 Feb '21

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 14th European Lisp Symposium Call for Papers May 3 - May 4, 2021 Online / Everywhere http://www.european-lisp-symposium.org/2021 Sponsored by EPITA and RavenPack ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Invited Speakers ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Nada Amin - Harvard SEAS others tba Important Dates ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ - Submission deadline: March 7, 2021 - Author notification: April 6, 2021 - Final papers due: April 19, 2021 - Symposium: May 3 - May 4, 2021 Scope ~~~~~ The European Lisp Symposium is a premier forum for the discussion and dissemination of all aspects of design, implementation and application of any of the Lisp dialects, including Common Lisp, Scheme, Emacs Lisp, Clojure, Racket, ACL2, AutoLisp, ISLISP, Dylan, SKILL, Hy, Shen, Carp, Janet, uLisp, Picolisp, Gamelisp, TXR, and so on. We encourage everyone interested in Lisp to participate. The European Lisp Symposium 2021 invites high quality papers about novel research results, insights and lessons learned from practical applications, and educational perspectives. We also encourage submissions about known ideas as long as they are presented in a new setting and/or in a highly elegant way. Topics include but are not limited to: - Context-, aspect-, domain-oriented and generative programming - Macro-, reflective-, meta- and/or rule-based development approaches - Language design and implementation - Language integration, inter-operation and deployment - Development methodologies, support and environments - Educational approaches and perspectives - Experience reports and case studies Technical Program ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ We invite submissions in the following forms: * Papers: Technical papers of up to 8 pages that describe original results or explain known ideas in new and elegant ways. * Demonstrations: Abstracts of up to 4 pages for demonstrations of tools, libraries, and applications. * Tutorials: Abstracts of up to 4 pages for in-depth presentations about topics of special interest for at least 90 minutes and up to 180 minutes. All submissions should be formatted following the ACM SIGS guidelines and include ACM Computing Classification System 2012 concepts and terms. Submissions should be uploaded to Easy Chair, at the following http://www.easychair.org/conferences/?conf=els2021 Note: to help us with the review process please indicate the type of submission by entering either "paper", "demo", or "tutorial" in the Keywords field. Programme Chair ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Marco Heisig - FAU Erlangen-Nürnberg, Germany Local Chairs ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Michał Herda Mark Evenson - RavenPack Programme Committee ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Ioanna Dimitriou - Igalia Irène Durand - LaBRI University of Bordeaux R. Matthew Emerson - thoughtstuff LLC Matthew Flatt - University of Utah Jonathan Godbout - Google Paulo Matos - Linki Tools David McClain - SpectroDynamics, LLC Stefan Monnier - University of Montreal Jim Newton - EPITA Research Lab Kent Pitman - HyperMeta Inc. Christophe Rhodes - Google Kai Selgrad - OTH Regensburg Olin Shivers - Northeastern University Robert Smith - Rigetti Quantum Computing Michael Sperber - DeinProgramm Evrim Ulu - Middle East Technical University Breanndán Ó Nualláin - Machine Learning Programs -- Lisp, Jazz, Aïkido: http://www.didierverna.info

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Pattern, Abstract Factory / Factory
by Manfred Bergmann 08 Feb '21

08 Feb '21

Hello. I am trying to discover design patterns and how they are implemented in Common Lisp. According to Peter Norvig (http://norvig.com/design-patterns/design-patterns.pdf) and this source (https://wiki.c2.com/?AreDesignPatternsMissingLanguageFeatures) some design pattern are more simple in Common Lisp, or are actually not needed at all because the language can be extended to achieve the same thing: extendability, separation, abstraction. Taking an Abstract Factory for example, the sources say that metaclasses can help do this. I’ve read a bit about metaclasses and the MOP but I fail to see how. I could probably come up with something. A GUI framework for example. I could create something like this : — (defclass meta-button (standard-class) ((gui-button-backend :initform nil :accessor gui-button-backend))) (defmethod closer-mop:validate-superclass ((class meta-button) (superclass standard-class)) t) (defclass button () () (:metaclass meta-button)) (defun make-button () (make-instance 'button)) — And configure a QT or GTK, Motif (or whatever) button backend to the metaclass on startup (or so). But I think this would just be the pattern somehow turned into a metaclass. Doesn’t feel like the right thing. Does anyone know what Peter Norvig had in mind when he said that metaclasses can be used instead of Abstract Factory pattern? Cheers, Manfred

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